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Create Alignment By PI Issue!

  • 1.  Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-11-2021 05:12
      |   view attached
    I have seen a few time when entering an alignment by PI.  It does not pick up the PC and PT correctly following the plan alignment report.  I was recently creating an alignment and notice that a curve followed by another curve had a different bearing going into the second curve.  This made the second curve's length extended by 10'  I can go do the create alignment by segment which is not the option I want to use.  Following the build of an alignment i need to generate some report that gives me coords by the PI stations.  I am a HCSS user and we upload the alignments into our plans.  The alignment looks fine in HCSS at the PC and PT of the curve where I am having issues.  I tried entering a no curve instruction for the PC and error show ups saying curve not fit.  Image below shows my alignment created by PI's and by segments.  the By Segment is the correct alignment and the PI is incorrect.  I am also attaching the alignment report.
    Any ideas on how to fix this By PI or is this a bug??


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    Francisco Guerrero
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    Attachment(s)

    pdf
    3 Sheets - 1210 - Kaufman FM 1390 - TxDOT (1).pdf   609 KB 1 version


  • 2.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-11-2021 15:07
    Hey Frank,

    I will take a look at this and see if I can reproduce the issue.

    Shane

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    Shane Odenbach
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    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-11-2021 15:53
    Frank,

    After working through your PI data I believe your issue is coming from the PI that is added onto the PDF as shown below:



    The alignment geometry checks great until this curve and then everything is off after it and the error compounds as you move down the alignment. I would verify this data is correct as I believe it is the cause of your issue. 

    Running the Alignment Geometry report can really help verifying your data when you hand enter alignments.

    Let me know what you find out.

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    Shane Odenbach
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    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-11-2021 21:13
    Yeah,  the alignment report was missing a Curve data that I manually wrote on the sheet.  I see I did not write the PI cord.  I will get that cord tomorrow.  If you see the image, at station 122+xx is the curve that is causing the issue.

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    Francisco Guerrero
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    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-12-2021 08:30
      |   view attached
    I will just give you the XML of the alignment i created.  To review what i have done.

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    Francisco Guerrero
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    Attachment(s)

    xml
    KAUFMAN FM 1390.xml   12 KB 1 version
    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-12-2021 09:44
    Hey Frank,

    When I built the alignment yesterday the curve data started to deviate from the plans at the curve at station 57+43.4, the length, bearing and PT station were all slightly off, after this curve the errors from plan grow as you move down the alignment. This is what makes me believe that this curve has incorrect data.

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    Shane Odenbach
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    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-12-2021 11:50
      |   view attached
    using PC and PT coordinates, gives me the correct alignment.  The report is correct as i created points for each PC and PT so i can cross reference my alignment.  just that one station where is giving me issue as the curve is in a reverse curve and not tangent, which leads me to believe that the "By PI" does not recognize the reverse curve bearing.  here is the alignment i built using the "By Segment". chec it out and let me know what you see and think.

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    Francisco Guerrero
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    Attachment(s)

    xml
    By Segment HAL.xml   12 KB 1 version
    Original Message


  • 8.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-17-2021 15:04
    I just received another project.  Again, have the same issue using create alignment By PI.  Is there something I am missing or is this a glitch in TBC.    This only happens in the PI when the ingoing bearing is different from the previous bearing, when usually it is just tangent.  Now after creating the alignment using By PI, I have to redo the alignment using By Segment.

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    Francisco Guerrero
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    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-17-2021 15:47

    Hey Frank,

    Can you share you new data? In the previous example I have looked at the segment Alignment and an Alignment created from the PI method and again I believe that this issue is caused by the PI data on your alignment pdf. the the photo below you will see a geometry report of the segment method alignment. I also double checked the PI coordinate by creating to tangent lines from the tangents on either side of the curve. you will notice that the PI Coordinate in the report and the grid point differ from the PI coordinate listed on your pdf. I believe that the difference in these coordinates is the cause of your issue in this example as it is propagating through your other curves. 



    I would be happy to take a look at your new alignment data but with the previous example I am not seeing any indication of error in the alignment calculation, the error is derived from the PI coordinate difference in that case, as this PI is being used to calculate the AH an BK bearing and PC, PT Stations. 

    We could also do a go to meeting if you would like and I can go over my findings with you.

    Hope this helps,

    Shane



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    Shane Odenbach
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    Original Message


  • 10.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-17-2021 19:39
      |   view attached
    alright,  lets give this one a try.  the last report had missing data that i had to fish for and did not add all that to that report.  Sometimes i grind my teeth when i see some alignment report that are half there.  
    lets try this one By PI

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    Francisco Guerrero
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    Attachment(s)

    pdf
    FM780.pdf   906 KB 1 version
    Original Message


  • 11.  RE: Create Alignment By PI Issue!

    Posted 02-19-2021 10:13
    Hey Frank,

    I will take a look at your new data today and let you know what I find.

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    Shane Odenbach
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    Original Message