Trimble Business Center

When importing a Geo7Xcm SSF file the receiver type is defaulting to Geo7Hcm, presumably because the only other alternative in the drop-down list is Geo7X and no option is present for Geo7Xcm.
This creates potential confusion and traceability issues and I'm also wondering if there could also be resultant disadvantages in the post-processing. How can the functionality for Geo7Xcm be added? 

And how can the estimated precisions for embedded points in the SSF file be obtained in similar way that PFO would readily report these out of post processing? I understand the survey strategy behind the TBC processing engine is different but everything needed is there in the file begging to come out. Leaving lines aside as trajectories is fine, but for points the requirement is similar.

Thanks

------------------------------
John Winkler
------------------------------

John,

I believe it's a typo. I see this behavior as well. The baseline processing still works properly. Regarding the GNSS metadata (specifically RMS), that is a weakness that I have brought up to Trimble. Like you said, the engine is different in PFO versus TBC so the GNSS metadata are not stored when processing is set to store Continuous as trajectory in the processing options. If you set that option to no and process, you can at least get GNSS metadata from the vectors from each epoch. You can export and then average the epochs to get your final points with metadata. It's definitely more involved but it's the only way that I know how to get this done.   



------------------------------
Zach Edwards
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-28-2022 00:05
From: John Winkler
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

When importing a Geo7Xcm SSF file the receiver type is defaulting to Geo7Hcm, presumably because the only other alternative in the drop-down list is Geo7X and no option is present for Geo7Xcm.
This creates potential confusion and traceability issues and I'm also wondering if there could also be resultant disadvantages in the post-processing. How can the functionality for Geo7Xcm be added? 

And how can the estimated precisions for embedded points in the SSF file be obtained in similar way that PFO would readily report these out of post processing? I understand the survey strategy behind the TBC processing engine is different but everything needed is there in the file begging to come out. Leaving lines aside as trajectories is fine, but for points the requirement is similar.

Thanks

------------------------------
John Winkler
------------------------------

Thanks for pointing that out Zach. I can now see there is a huge amount of underlying detailed information that is already processed and available on an epoch-by-epoch basis, but surprisingly it's not applied, or easily able to be rolled up, to the overlying trajectory points.

For example, I've recorded 5 points of interest in the field and simply want the coordinates and horizontal & vertical precisions for each. But this is not available. However, by saying No to Continuous as Trajectory I can see underlying these points are 530 epoch vectors, and each and every one of these does have the precisions plus more. But there is no easy way to relate the vector information to the 5 points.

In TBC I can sort, slice and dice and select whatever range of precision of vectors I want. But to do anything further then becomes manual and excruciating. The vectors can be linked to each of the 5 points by timestamp, and for each group in a spreadsheet I can average and even attempt to apply crude weighting formulas. But as expected every attempt results in the coordinates varying, and all of these coordinates are different to the coordinates provided by selecting yes for continuous as trajectory and it's not clear which are better or worse.

None of the Trajectory, or manually averaged and migrating Vector points, is giving me the precisions.

So at this stage it appears there is no option but to continue SSF processing in PFO.

It would be good if Trimble could acknowledge and confirm when this is going to be addressed in TBC?

------------------------------
John Winkler
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-29-2022 08:32
From: Zach Edwards
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

John,

I believe it's a typo. I see this behavior as well. The baseline processing still works properly. Regarding the GNSS metadata (specifically RMS), that is a weakness that I have brought up to Trimble. Like you said, the engine is different in PFO versus TBC so the GNSS metadata are not stored when processing is set to store Continuous as trajectory in the processing options. If you set that option to no and process, you can at least get GNSS metadata from the vectors from each epoch. You can export and then average the epochs to get your final points with metadata. It's definitely more involved but it's the only way that I know how to get this done.   

------------------------------
Zach Edwards

Original Message:
Sent: 12-28-2022 00:05
From: John Winkler
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

When importing a Geo7Xcm SSF file the receiver type is defaulting to Geo7Hcm, presumably because the only other alternative in the drop-down list is Geo7X and no option is present for Geo7Xcm.
This creates potential confusion and traceability issues and I'm also wondering if there could also be resultant disadvantages in the post-processing. How can the functionality for Geo7Xcm be added? 

And how can the estimated precisions for embedded points in the SSF file be obtained in similar way that PFO would readily report these out of post processing? I understand the survey strategy behind the TBC processing engine is different but everything needed is there in the file begging to come out. Leaving lines aside as trajectories is fine, but for points the requirement is similar.

Thanks

------------------------------
John Winkler
------------------------------

John,

I can confirm your conclusion - it is far easier and essentially meaningful to use Pathfinder Office for
processing of Geo7X SSF files (and generally, for any SSF files) than TBC and I also use PFO for this reason.

I also had some issues when processing SSF files in TBC in the past.
As an example - at least, in prior versions of TBC than v5.81 (with this latest version I did not try till now, since I suppose nothing changed)
- there was no way to  export attributes coming from DDF (created in Data Dictionary Editor within PFO)
and stored in a SSF file to an user defined format. I reported this to support a year ago or maybe earlier - nothing changed.

So, if you do not want to waste your time with processing of SSF files with TBC,
use Pathfinder Office and forget the TBC GIS module (at least for now).

Martin

------------------------------
Martin Kalafut
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-05-2023 04:23
From: John Winkler
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

Thanks for pointing that out Zach. I can now see there is a huge amount of underlying detailed information that is already processed and available on an epoch-by-epoch basis, but surprisingly it's not applied, or easily able to be rolled up, to the overlying trajectory points.

For example, I've recorded 5 points of interest in the field and simply want the coordinates and horizontal & vertical precisions for each. But this is not available. However, by saying No to Continuous as Trajectory I can see underlying these points are 530 epoch vectors, and each and every one of these does have the precisions plus more. But there is no easy way to relate the vector information to the 5 points.

In TBC I can sort, slice and dice and select whatever range of precision of vectors I want. But to do anything further then becomes manual and excruciating. The vectors can be linked to each of the 5 points by timestamp, and for each group in a spreadsheet I can average and even attempt to apply crude weighting formulas. But as expected every attempt results in the coordinates varying, and all of these coordinates are different to the coordinates provided by selecting yes for continuous as trajectory and it's not clear which are better or worse.

None of the Trajectory, or manually averaged and migrating Vector points, is giving me the precisions.

So at this stage it appears there is no option but to continue SSF processing in PFO.

It would be good if Trimble could acknowledge and confirm when this is going to be addressed in TBC?

------------------------------
John Winkler

Original Message:
Sent: 12-29-2022 08:32
From: Zach Edwards
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

John,

I believe it's a typo. I see this behavior as well. The baseline processing still works properly. Regarding the GNSS metadata (specifically RMS), that is a weakness that I have brought up to Trimble. Like you said, the engine is different in PFO versus TBC so the GNSS metadata are not stored when processing is set to store Continuous as trajectory in the processing options. If you set that option to no and process, you can at least get GNSS metadata from the vectors from each epoch. You can export and then average the epochs to get your final points with metadata. It's definitely more involved but it's the only way that I know how to get this done.   

------------------------------
Zach Edwards

Original Message:
Sent: 12-28-2022 00:05
From: John Winkler
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

When importing a Geo7Xcm SSF file the receiver type is defaulting to Geo7Hcm, presumably because the only other alternative in the drop-down list is Geo7X and no option is present for Geo7Xcm.
This creates potential confusion and traceability issues and I'm also wondering if there could also be resultant disadvantages in the post-processing. How can the functionality for Geo7Xcm be added? 

And how can the estimated precisions for embedded points in the SSF file be obtained in similar way that PFO would readily report these out of post processing? I understand the survey strategy behind the TBC processing engine is different but everything needed is there in the file begging to come out. Leaving lines aside as trajectories is fine, but for points the requirement is similar.

Thanks

------------------------------
John Winkler
------------------------------

Could Trimble please confirm how we will be able to get estimated precisions for embedded points in the SSF file?

It's important to have these in a similar way PFO would readily report them out of post processing for continuation with TBC.

Thanks

------------------------------
John Winkler
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-05-2023 05:28
From: Martin Kalafut
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

John,

I can confirm your conclusion - it is far easier and essentially meaningful to use Pathfinder Office for
processing of Geo7X SSF files (and generally, for any SSF files) than TBC and I also use PFO for this reason.

I also had some issues when processing SSF files in TBC in the past.
As an example - at least, in prior versions of TBC than v5.81 (with this latest version I did not try till now, since I suppose nothing changed)
- there was no way to  export attributes coming from DDF (created in Data Dictionary Editor within PFO)
and stored in a SSF file to an user defined format. I reported this to support a year ago or maybe earlier - nothing changed.

So, if you do not want to waste your time with processing of SSF files with TBC,
use Pathfinder Office and forget the TBC GIS module (at least for now).

Martin

------------------------------
Martin Kalafut

Original Message:
Sent: 01-05-2023 04:23
From: John Winkler
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

Thanks for pointing that out Zach. I can now see there is a huge amount of underlying detailed information that is already processed and available on an epoch-by-epoch basis, but surprisingly it's not applied, or easily able to be rolled up, to the overlying trajectory points.

For example, I've recorded 5 points of interest in the field and simply want the coordinates and horizontal & vertical precisions for each. But this is not available. However, by saying No to Continuous as Trajectory I can see underlying these points are 530 epoch vectors, and each and every one of these does have the precisions plus more. But there is no easy way to relate the vector information to the 5 points.

In TBC I can sort, slice and dice and select whatever range of precision of vectors I want. But to do anything further then becomes manual and excruciating. The vectors can be linked to each of the 5 points by timestamp, and for each group in a spreadsheet I can average and even attempt to apply crude weighting formulas. But as expected every attempt results in the coordinates varying, and all of these coordinates are different to the coordinates provided by selecting yes for continuous as trajectory and it's not clear which are better or worse.

None of the Trajectory, or manually averaged and migrating Vector points, is giving me the precisions.

So at this stage it appears there is no option but to continue SSF processing in PFO.

It would be good if Trimble could acknowledge and confirm when this is going to be addressed in TBC?

------------------------------
John Winkler

Original Message:
Sent: 12-29-2022 08:32
From: Zach Edwards
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

John,

I believe it's a typo. I see this behavior as well. The baseline processing still works properly. Regarding the GNSS metadata (specifically RMS), that is a weakness that I have brought up to Trimble. Like you said, the engine is different in PFO versus TBC so the GNSS metadata are not stored when processing is set to store Continuous as trajectory in the processing options. If you set that option to no and process, you can at least get GNSS metadata from the vectors from each epoch. You can export and then average the epochs to get your final points with metadata. It's definitely more involved but it's the only way that I know how to get this done.   

------------------------------
Zach Edwards

Original Message:
Sent: 12-28-2022 00:05
From: John Winkler
Subject: Import receiver type Geo7Xcm & SSF point precisions

When importing a Geo7Xcm SSF file the receiver type is defaulting to Geo7Hcm, presumably because the only other alternative in the drop-down list is Geo7X and no option is present for Geo7Xcm.
This creates potential confusion and traceability issues and I'm also wondering if there could also be resultant disadvantages in the post-processing. How can the functionality for Geo7Xcm be added? 

And how can the estimated precisions for embedded points in the SSF file be obtained in similar way that PFO would readily report these out of post processing? I understand the survey strategy behind the TBC processing engine is different but everything needed is there in the file begging to come out. Leaving lines aside as trajectories is fine, but for points the requirement is similar.

Thanks

------------------------------
John Winkler
------------------------------