Trimble Business Center

Recently I did a machine control file ( motor grader ) on a roadway.  The file contained the SVL which had the edge of road base,  the edge of concrete pavement and crown( center line of the road).  I was not aware that the SVD would create a line for the limits of the SVD.  I get a call asking which line was the line for the edge of base and was told there are three (3) outer lines.  I know there should be only two (2) and I ask for a screen shot. and three (3) lines appear.  

 Does the SVD have an option to disable the edgeline of the design?  

<updated with Machine Control files >

Did not see this happening. Are you sure you did not export extra line? Also maybe your SVD surface file is created from XML and then it took the breakline (just a thought). Maybe if you make your surface exactly on the limit of the lines, then you should not have this problem. Never had a problem like this.

I created my surface from two(2) roads using the side slope command.  I joined two (2) surface and did a boundary to clip them.  I did a clean project and imported the SVD and SVL.  There were no other lines besides the edge base and edge pavement. 

You can import the SVL file into TBC and look at it.

If you dont send linework then the SVD will have a limit line that shows the limit oc the surface but this should not be a Selectable line.

If you created a boundary to  clip the surface that would be one line and the linework would be a second line, but not sure where the third line comes from - would have to see the project - if the two source surfaces you merged had edge lines that could be it?

Alan

i have attached my MC file that was uploaded into the motor grader.  I have a linework file attached with the design.  No boundaries were uploaded into the machine file.  So , even thou the boundary lines were not uploaded into the file.  The boundary lines can still be sent with the design as linework???

I just loaded your SVL and SVD into TBC and GCS900.

As you can see in below screenshot, you have a magenta and red line which would be your edge of road base and the edge of concrete pavement.

From the triangles you can see they are formed to a line further out and not the red one (pavement).

This will appear in GCS900 as 3 lines - magenta, red and light grey. The light grey is the outer "boundary" of the surface and is also selectable for guidance in GCS900. This cannot be disabled in GCS900.

FWIW - if you only upload the SVD the operator will still see the outer boundaries of the surface as the grey line:

This line will be selectable for Horizontal Offset to show the distance to the line.

It cannot be used for Lane Guidance - this will require the SVL with the appropriate lines.

thank you Lasse, 

this has helped as I was not aware of the design limit line and I was told by other coworker that I should not have three line.  I now know to either extend the design or place the design at the edge of base .

Your welcome :-)

i have installed a emulator of machine control.  more so i can know the buttons and now so i can see my file i dump into the machine.  how do you upload your own files into the emulator? 

 this is the download i have 

GCS900 or Earthworks Simulator?

Alan

On Fri, Jul 10, 2020 at 8:37 AM frank.guerrero@ebcc.com <trimble@jiveon.com>

You need to create the Design Files using TBC for a device that you set up using Controller Manager for GCS900 and the version that you are running. once you have created the Design Files, then I typically copy the Design Folders to the MCGSIM data folder which is typically going to be C:\MCGSim_Data\Earthmoving\MCGData-TRMB-CB460-V13.15 for example and then you can run the emulator and use the Select Desgn Function to see them. 

You can path the simulator to look at your Sync Folder directly but I dont typically do that, as I dont want to mess with the Machine CFG and DSP files that are setup in the simulator.

Alan

The GCS900 12.80 emulator has a bug in it, so it cannot work as an excavator (sensor errors). Works as a dozer though.

I've sent 13.15 to you through WeTransfer.

Once installed you need to set it up - I usually do this:

MENU - Restore Settings - Machine Settings - EXCAVATOR 3D HS - OK

Sometimes it doesn't default add receivers, so you have to manually select them in the little add-on that starts with the software:

After that you can change from 2D to 3D here:

The default path for you design-files will be like Alan mentioned:

C:\MCGSim_Data\Earthmoving\MCGData-TRMB-CB460-V13.13\

"Earthmoving" mimics the machine folder on TCC, and "MCGData-TRMB-CB460-V13.13" would be the Machine Control Data folder.

In case you reference a geoid in TBC make sure this geoid-file is also copied to the emulator, or it will throw an error:

C:\MCGSim_Data\Earthmoving\MCGData-TRMB-CB460-V13.13\GeoData

thank you.  I will try this at some point this week.

is there one for a motor grader?

Yes, it is the same software - when you go to Restore Settings you can select various machine files - there is also for dozer and motorgrader so it is easy to swap.

After loading the machine file you can edit it - fx I add a SNM940 in the config to get access to me Connectivity Settings menu for when showing how to setup VRS or similar. Then you can save it as your own custom excavator machine file for future use.

Hi Lasse,

Are you able to send through the GCS900 emulator to myself? I am looking at training my team on machine control for a site engineers role but want to show the machine control viewpoint from the operator. This way they will know what they are seeing when dozing and also gives a chance to verify our machine control files.

many thanks

tim

Send me a message and I will hook you up

i have a few questions i have been wanting to be abit more trained on the machine control and will have to do this on my own..  i have been wanting to be verseWhat purpose does the .cfg file serve?  i see this file when export the .svd/.svl files.  I see that one is able to upload alignments.  how do you export from TBC and how do you import into CB460?  what is the benefit of having the alignment?

Frank

The file formats used by the GCS900 system are as follows

SVD = Surface Design File - this is a TIN Model and provides the machine with elevation information when selected

SVL = Linework Design File - The lines can be an Alignment (provides the machine with Station and Offset and allows operator to know where they are on the road), and linework for guidance -this allows the operator to select a line and use it for guidance of the blade - they can reference the line on the machine to guide the blade (typically the left or right edge of the blade), and with eg a Motor Grader they can have Side Shift installed on the Grader and that will automatically control the lateral movement of the blade to follow the line - helpful when they are trying to avoid structures in the ground already like Curb and Gutter or a Bridge Wall or Columns / Piers etc. or just when they want to track the edge of a surface area perfectly etc. or the base of a ditch or embankment or wall or footing etc.

CFG =  This is the Site Calibration or Coordinate System - it is the equivalent of a DC file in SCS900 or Access. It provides the transformation parameters to get from GPS in WGS84 Lat Long Height to the local site cooredinate system in N, E, Z - it contains the link to a Geoid File that helps adjust for elevation error and also if you are using a specific Coordinate System Projection and Datum it can carry that also. 

So for example if you start a TBC project and import a Site Cal, TTM (or surface) and DXF (linework) file then when you create the data for the machine the Site Cal from the project is written as a CFG file, the TTM is written as a SVD file and the DXF linework as a SVL file. Those are written into a folder on your computer.

To create the data for a machine you run the Construction Data commands to create a Jobsite first and then a Design second and when creating the Jobsite it associates the Project Site Calibration to the output Jobsite and the Design can be a Surface Model (TTM Data) and Linework (DXF Data) and it will write the 3 files - .cfg, ,svd, .svl into a folder for a GCS900 machine. Typically you use the Controller Manager to create a Machine - that defines if it is GCS900 and then what version of GCS900 you are running - there have been numerous changes over the versions of GCS900 so you have to write each machines data with a specific variant of the SVD/SVL/CFG files. Typically the Machine will be created in a folder called Trimble Synchronizer Data on your c:\ Drive. GCS900 does not have the concept of a Site - it just has Designs and each design is a package of the three files. Those files are prepared so that you can transfer them through the Sync Process to the field systems via Trimble Connected Community. However your machine simulator is installed and points at a different file location - it points to a folder as follows (I am using a CB460 Emulator and v13.15 and that controls the last part of the path name

c:\MCGSim_Data\Earthmoving\MCGData-TRMB-CB460-V13.15\

The design package that you write to Trimble Synchronizer Data can be copied and pasted into this path and the simulator will then find it and allow you to load it.

I will try to find time this week to record you a video of the process

Alan

FWIW I believe above is correct if replacing cfg with cal?

The .cal file with link to a geoid and keep the transformation data to the entire CS, making it usable to the CS extent.

The .cfg is more local, and only keeps a subgrid of the geoid for use in GCS900 12.50 and older, and limited in, I believe, 2kb size, to allow it to load into the MS990s.

It will be forward compatible to newer versions of GCS900, but only work within a small area, where the .cal-file will reference the geoid etc and work everywhere within the CS/geoid - but will not be supported in pre 12.60 GCS900.

Messing with the setting I did see that we can add text for alignment on the CB460.  If we can get the man in charge of the machine control to start using this.  this will keep us from adding station on our SVL.

That be great,  thanks Alan

I have another hair scratching question. More I am wanting to learn on grade control.  Can you extend the design slope?  In the image below will detail what I am having a question on.  My model has driveway blockout which makes my design stop at the gutter line. Else where my model goes from the gutter up to top curb and over to the top of slope.  So, when the blade is cutting for subgrade ( which is 1.50' from back of curb) and has the vertical offset set.  Can the CB460 extend my slope at the driveway where my model stops at the gutter line.  I am being told the CB460 will not extend the slope.  I would either have to add curb where the driveway is or completely do away with all curb. 

The lane guidance function on the CB460 will let you extend the design slope under the curb features for doing the subgrade

In the image below shows the blockout.  Will the lane guidance be easy to use for where there is curb and no curb without having to go keep making changes to the lane guidance?

If you include the linework in the design, in GCS900 it is as simple as a push of a button.

Keep the focus point between two lines and hit the Lane Guidance button to activate it on the lane you are in - then push again to deactivate it.

To swap lane (when already activated) move the focus point into the new lane, and hit the Lane Guidance button 2 times - to deactivate the old and activate the new. 

Though with the data you showed, as there are no lines defining the curb in the cut-out, you will only be able to extend the road surface into the cut out.

I suppose if you are lucky and the slope are the same, you could then do a vertical offset to be able to work in the cut out :-)

okay,  let me take a moment.  There will be added linework added the to GCS900 file.  It will not be 3D if that matter in this scenario.  For every GCS900 file we upload there is always a 2D SVL and the SVD file. 

So,  if I add lines from (for this 2 way road) the center to the back of curb,  then the Lane Guidance would use the 2D lines to extend the road cross slope?  I will try this on the GCS900 emulator and try it out.  The model setting in the GCS900 is where I want to focus on getting trained on next.  

testing done and works as you guys mentioned.  This is great and now to somehow convince the grade control guy to use this tool.  Small curve ball on getting a line to be used as a alignment. this is great.  thanks fellas.

Just to mention it in case you haven't seen it.

If the small little edge is visible  then you can long press the button and select any two lines to define the grade. If you don't have a road job with a master alignment, you can use one of the two lines as master alignment or one that is more or less parallel to the grade you'll define. The grey line, that defines the grade you are working to is always perpendicular to that master alignment. Which side is red/green is unimportant.

 the cross hair only needs to be close to the line, once you press one of the buttons it will use the nearest line.

If that little corner is not visible then it's disabled. In the simulator you can switch to manager mode with STRG+m, go to Installation -> Operator Configuration.

That function is handy to extend batters of pit excavations to natural ground for instance and works with any model, doesn't need to be a road design.