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TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

  • 1.  TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-15-2022 05:49
    HI All,

    Looking for a TML to create a line or surface at the bottom of a utility node based on the node geometry. The option to offset as well would be awesome, i.e 2 foot over excavation. Maybe the option to also extract at the top of the utility with ability to distinguish as top; new surface, new line layer or name line top. 

    I use the utility module for modeling buildings foundation because then you can create a type for each footing. The downside is trying to extract anything usable to add to a surface or linework for the field devices. I think modeling this way, more BIM tracked, has the ability to save time but there are certain elements that we need to be able to extract to create surfaces. 



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    Patrick L'heureux
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  • 2.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-19-2022 01:06
    Hi Patrick,
    I assume you are using "Junction Boxes" as node type? (Circular Manhole will be simpler anyway)

    I might have a look on the weekend.

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    Ronny Schneider
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  • 3.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-19-2022 01:24
    For this application primarily junction boxes but I do use circular manholes quite a bit as well. Thank you

    Patrick L'Heureux

    Sent from my iPhone





  • 4.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-21-2022 21:11
      |   view attached
    Hello Patrick,
    since we had a rather short notice public holiday this week I had some time to look into this.
    I added this functionality to the macro that sets the rim or floor elevation from a DTM.

    For the new part you don't need a DTM but the nodes need to have the correct elevation already.
    It works for circular manholes and Junction Boxes.
    If you enter an offset of Zero it will only create one line, along the outside of the box.
    If you enter an offset it will create two lines.
    You can enter negative offsets (to the inside), but I don't know how useful that is. At some point, with very large offsets that will probably result in some weird linework.

    Let me know if you find some bugs.

    Cheers
    Ronny

    ------------------------------
    Ronny Schneider
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    Attachment(s)

    zip
    SCR_ManholeSurfaceRL.zip   12 KB 1 version


  • 5.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-23-2022 01:04
    Incredible. This is great. Results looked great with the couple quick test I did last night. 

    2 request I have if they aren't heavy lifts:

    • Option to add these newly created lines to a surface
    • Option to use the lines as surface boundaries for the assigned surface. 
    • Maybe a future option for a vertical offset of the lines?


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    Patrick L'heureux
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  • 6.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-23-2022 02:36
    Maybe a couple hours worth of work down to seconds. 

    There is no way of tying the elevation of a line to a point is there? I am not seeing anything even natively in TBC. We have dependent point which do the reverse. This would just help make these lines dynamic. 



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    Patrick L'heureux
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  • 7.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-23-2022 02:42
    One small quirk I saw with the junction boxes, it looks like the elevation at the nodes are not all the same as the reference rim/invert point. Very small difference, in  the 1000s, but still odd. Modeling in US Survey feet.



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    Patrick L'heureux
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  • 8.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-23-2022 06:43
      |   view attached
    Hi Patrick,
    have a look at the new attached version.
    I found that elevation issue. For some reason a vector I use to compute the 4 corners wasn't created 100 % horizontal. Don't know why, it's an internal function. After it's creation I now force it to zero/horizontal.
    I've also added some additional offset functionality and adding to an existing surface.

    For the DTM creation with the circular manholes I need to approximate the arc with a polyline. That is done with a built in function.
    See line 454 in this version. TBC computes internally everything in meters.
    Linearize(0.0001, 0.0001, 0.1, None, False)​
    It's currently hardcoded to deviate less than 1/10 of a mm in horizontal/vertical or max. 0.1 m node spacing, whichever hits first.

    Let me know if you find another bug.

    About that line elevation tie thing. You can define stringlines by point ID instead of easting/northing. If the point is changed the line will move.
    You'd need at least one actual point per line, which you'd have to select. The amount of points you'd have to select would be the same as the line count. No real difference.
    It's probably easier to keep the lines on separate layers and select by layer and change by delta elevation.

    ------------------------------
    Ronny Schneider
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    Attachment(s)

    zip
    SCR_ManholeSurfaceRL.zip   13 KB 1 version


  • 9.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-23-2022 23:27
    That was a crappy way to add the lines to the surface. You couldn't "select surface members" or delete them from the surface anymore.
    Had to do some digging since adding lines to a surface was never shown in one of the sample macros, but I found out how to do it.
    It's rather simple once you know it. It expects a list with the whole line/arc-objects in it, not just the serial numbers. So I don't have to do the linearization for the arcs myself anymore but it utilizes the project settings.

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    Ronny Schneider
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  • 10.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-23-2022 23:40
      |   view attached
    Quickly fixed another bug. Somehow I can't delete all of the previous versions in the thread.

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    Ronny Schneider
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    Attachment(s)

    zip
    SCR_ManholeSurfaceRL.zip   13 KB 1 version


  • 11.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-24-2022 00:03
    Just out of curiosity, is using those utility nodes actually faster and more versatile for you than "CreateSideSlope"?

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    Ronny Schneider
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  • 12.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-24-2022 03:55
    Looks good. I noticed that yesterday but you beat me to it.

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    Patrick L'heureux
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  • 13.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-24-2022 04:14
    Edited by Patrick L'heureux 09-24-2022 04:15
    It depends. 

    With what you created, it just made this process a lot faster because I would have to create all of my nodes and then go back and create all of linework that would actually be usable for the field or surface model. 

    The reason why I tend to lean towards the use of nodes is for a BIM experience. With the footings looking like 3D shapes and thanks to some of Gary's additional smart codes, it is easy to do a QA/QC of data without creating a bunch of separate text items/surfaces/linework.



    I like side slope but the issue with a project like this with +100 piers, is that you would have to manually select each master line. There is no automated process for selecting multiple lines at once and applying the same template ( maybe an idea for next holiday ;)  ) This would actually really compliment what you just created. Maybe an option to add side slope to the line extracted from the rim/floor.

    The side slopes are also disconnected. I think the new sub template could help with this because you create a subtemplate that then the side slopes reference.

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    Patrick L'heureux
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  • 14.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-24-2022 04:18


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    Patrick L'heureux
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  • 15.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-27-2022 16:36
    This is really cool, Pat.

    Connect always shows your custom utility shape as round?​

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    Nelson Hays
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  • 16.  RE: TML - Create Line Surface at Bottom of Utility Nodes

    Posted 09-27-2022 17:35
    Thanks Nelson!

    Unfortunately yes, they always show up as round. Hoping they can change this because there is some wild stuff you can do. Also great for viewing with SiteVIsion and HoloLens. 

    Patrick L'Heureux

    Sent from my iPhone