Trimble Business Center

Hello All,

I realize this may be the wrong location, but we did detect the issue while trying to reconcile Trimble X7 Perspective registered, refined and georeferenced scan data into TBC job file with SX10 total station control, and SX10 point cloud scanning.

No matter what we have tried the X7 data will not acceptability registered to the SX10.  The Perspecitve in field georeferencing shows unacceptable high levels of vertical errors, bordering at about 0.2 feet over a project size that look like to plus signs '+' stacked on top of each other with the longest street corridor being about 500 feet on each side, east west, north south, more or less.

The error in the georeferencing is not due to the control.  Each control point being used in the georeferencing of the X7 data has been measured several times from multiple from several independent and dependent locations and the control is within about 0.02 feet both horizontally and vertically based on a review of the multiple measurements.

The Persceptive export and refine registration report is red hot and when the X7 scans are review independent of any other information, this is one of the best registered set of scans i have seen.  No stratification, and scans blend horizontally and vertically one into the next, into the next one, etc, seamlessly.

Now to my assumption.  I think what has happened is the X7 inclinometer may have issues and therefore what the X7 thoughts was a self leveling done correctly had some level of error in all the scans, there by tilting the project.  Or that was my first guess.  What i think really results when this happens, is that it isn't tilted, the level of each scan tied to the one before it becomes arced with nonlinear growth, possibly exponential.

I have never had this issue.  Or equipment is well kept and field calibrated, colminated, etc before use.

I am hoping someone has some insight.  Please help.  This is about a week of work, 50 hours of field work, possibly that we can't fix maybe.

Thank you for all responses.  I am hoping to hear maybe from someone at Trimble that really understands this stuff.

------------------------------
Clayton Bradshaw
------------------------------

Hi Clayton,
Have you tried just registering each X7 scan to the SX10 scans?  I know you say that the X7 scans all come together fine (within Perspective), but there appears to something happening "globally" to the scans.  Perhaps, simply doing a pair-wise registration to the SX10 will clear things up.  Though this isn't as quick as just putting the two (X7 & SX10) together, it'll be "more correct."  I'd like to think that if it is your inclinometer, each scan isn't being affected as much as they would be collectively.  Maybe?

I realize this isn't what you're hoping for, but in the interim, this could solve your issue until you get an actual explanation from Trimble.

------------------------------
mark Prewitt
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 10-01-2022 11:27
From: Clayton Bradshaw
Subject: X7 Perspective Registered Data Out of Level 'Cupped'

Hello All,

I realize this may be the wrong location, but we did detect the issue while trying to reconcile Trimble X7 Perspective registered, refined and georeferenced scan data into TBC job file with SX10 total station control, and SX10 point cloud scanning.

No matter what we have tried the X7 data will not acceptability registered to the SX10.  The Perspecitve in field georeferencing shows unacceptable high levels of vertical errors, bordering at about 0.2 feet over a project size that look like to plus signs '+' stacked on top of each other with the longest street corridor being about 500 feet on each side, east west, north south, more or less.

The error in the georeferencing is not due to the control.  Each control point being used in the georeferencing of the X7 data has been measured several times from multiple from several independent and dependent locations and the control is within about 0.02 feet both horizontally and vertically based on a review of the multiple measurements.

The Persceptive export and refine registration report is red hot and when the X7 scans are review independent of any other information, this is one of the best registered set of scans i have seen.  No stratification, and scans blend horizontally and vertically one into the next, into the next one, etc, seamlessly.

Now to my assumption.  I think what has happened is the X7 inclinometer may have issues and therefore what the X7 thoughts was a self leveling done correctly had some level of error in all the scans, there by tilting the project.  Or that was my first guess.  What i think really results when this happens, is that it isn't tilted, the level of each scan tied to the one before it becomes arced with nonlinear growth, possibly exponential.

I have never had this issue.  Or equipment is well kept and field calibrated, colminated, etc before use.

I am hoping someone has some insight.  Please help.  This is about a week of work, 50 hours of field work, possibly that we can't fix maybe.

Thank you for all responses.  I am hoping to hear maybe from someone at Trimble that really understands this stuff.

------------------------------
Clayton Bradshaw
------------------------------

Mark,

Thank you for the input and this is the path we are going, in a round about manner.  We don't have sufficient SX10 scans, spaced close enough together, to approach this exactly as you have suggested and first we had to unlevel all the X7 scans.  Then i have been registering individual X7 to closest SX10 scans and working outward from SX10 scans and hopefully meeting in the middle with X7 scans that match each other.  In most instances this is working well, but in others I have begun to see the wag the dog happening, mostly in the horizontal though.

From what I have seen from the two software packages, Perspective and TBC, Perspective tends to do a better job with scan registration and refinement.  Though not always.

Regardless, we think we have a very time consuming solution, which is very similar to what you suggested, Mark, but I am also wondering, is this something that just happens, and how do we prevent it, or work with it.  The instrument was calibrated and within specifications, we are also sending it in for a complete work over at the Trimble dealer shop. 

Is it just expected to have tilt that cause cupping when you do route or long corridor type mapping?

I would love to hear more of your experience Mark and from other and all folks.

CB

------------------------------
Clayton Bradshaw
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 10-04-2022 09:42
From: mark Prewitt
Subject: X7 Perspective Registered Data Out of Level 'Cupped'

Hi Clayton,
Have you tried just registering each X7 scan to the SX10 scans?  I know you say that the X7 scans all come together fine (within Perspective), but there appears to something happening "globally" to the scans.  Perhaps, simply doing a pair-wise registration to the SX10 will clear things up.  Though this isn't as quick as just putting the two (X7 & SX10) together, it'll be "more correct."  I'd like to think that if it is your inclinometer, each scan isn't being affected as much as they would be collectively.  Maybe?

I realize this isn't what you're hoping for, but in the interim, this could solve your issue until you get an actual explanation from Trimble.

------------------------------
mark Prewitt

Original Message:
Sent: 10-01-2022 11:27
From: Clayton Bradshaw
Subject: X7 Perspective Registered Data Out of Level 'Cupped'

Hello All,

I realize this may be the wrong location, but we did detect the issue while trying to reconcile Trimble X7 Perspective registered, refined and georeferenced scan data into TBC job file with SX10 total station control, and SX10 point cloud scanning.

No matter what we have tried the X7 data will not acceptability registered to the SX10.  The Perspecitve in field georeferencing shows unacceptable high levels of vertical errors, bordering at about 0.2 feet over a project size that look like to plus signs '+' stacked on top of each other with the longest street corridor being about 500 feet on each side, east west, north south, more or less.

The error in the georeferencing is not due to the control.  Each control point being used in the georeferencing of the X7 data has been measured several times from multiple from several independent and dependent locations and the control is within about 0.02 feet both horizontally and vertically based on a review of the multiple measurements.

The Persceptive export and refine registration report is red hot and when the X7 scans are review independent of any other information, this is one of the best registered set of scans i have seen.  No stratification, and scans blend horizontally and vertically one into the next, into the next one, etc, seamlessly.

Now to my assumption.  I think what has happened is the X7 inclinometer may have issues and therefore what the X7 thoughts was a self leveling done correctly had some level of error in all the scans, there by tilting the project.  Or that was my first guess.  What i think really results when this happens, is that it isn't tilted, the level of each scan tied to the one before it becomes arced with nonlinear growth, possibly exponential.

I have never had this issue.  Or equipment is well kept and field calibrated, colminated, etc before use.

I am hoping someone has some insight.  Please help.  This is about a week of work, 50 hours of field work, possibly that we can't fix maybe.

Thank you for all responses.  I am hoping to hear maybe from someone at Trimble that really understands this stuff.

------------------------------
Clayton Bradshaw
------------------------------